The End

June 19th, 2011

I think this might be it. Second deposit on Carbon blown away – another consistent downhill slide showing all the signs of just plain losing. Not bad luck, not a downswing, just putting my money in behind and calling when I’m beat.

Options? Deposit again and keep trying, or maybe even get some microstakes coaching? There’s some coaching at $25/hr which is affordable I guess.

Or just give up? Spend my time on something else, find a new hobby that’s not depressing.

 

I think, sadly, that it should be the latter.

 

2008 – 2011

(blue = with Rakeback + bonuses)

14 comments
  1. Simon Debanks

    Sorry to hear you’re thinking of giving up :(
    It seems to me that you are very knowledgeable, and have many of the attributes necessary to be a winning player. From the hand histories that you kindly sent over I can’t really understand how things have gone so poorly for you. There were a few mistakes I’m sure, but isn’t that the point? The winners just make fewer than the losers…
    If you choose the coaching option, I would def be interested in hearing how it went because it’s something I’ve been thinking of doing myself because I’ve been break even for 200k hands or more now. If you do choose to give up, then best of luck with the future and it was nice talking poker with you!
    Simon

  2. Meteoric

    I think if I was less knowledgeable I’d carry on :-) The thing that causes me pause are the variance graphs where a 5bb/100 winner can be anywhere from a massive $$$ winner to a huge loser, and the rake.

    I’ve calculated my rates of rake for the stakes with the most hands – nl5 rush was -13bb/100 (36k hands – $246), 6max cash was -15bb/100 (30k hands – $229), nl2 was -14bb/100 (30k hands, $80).

    So according to that I’m actually a 10bb/100 winner, but I’m paying all my winnings to the poker sites. We argue that poker is a game of skill, but the house is still winning.

  3. Simon Debanks

    According to HEM I paid $942 in 93k hands at $25FR for -4bb/100. According to PT3 at $10FR I paid $1462 in 188k hands for -8bb/100. This doesn’t seem right to me, the HEM number looks way too low but the PT3 figure looks more reasonable given my ‘style’. How easy would poker be if rake didn’t exist?! It would be lovely if someone could create a simple poker client that offered rake free games. Oops, looks like some players are attempting just that: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/rake-free-open-poker-room-run-poker-community-938389/

    One of the reasons I picked full ring is because of the lower long term variance, my standard deviation is around 35BB/100 whereas I believe 6-max to typically be over 60BB/100. I’m not encouraging you to change games, but you’re right variance could certainly be a factor over that sort of sample size.

  4. yegor

    [ ] op is braziliand

  5. Meteoric

    :-( I know.

    I might have a go on BetRaiser. Two reasons it might prolong the time before redepositing – a) no rake, b) no players…

  6. Meteoric

    yeah, I’ve seen these non-corporate poker ideas. For a while I was quite taken by the p2p style where you don’t have a central server – all quite possible.

    However it all falls apart once you think about it enough. The first reason is the money – bitcoin is crap (and from the recent devaluation it’s unreliable too), and the second is traffic. Without a company putting the effort into marketing (because they expect a ROI on that & make loads), then traffic will never grow. No matter how much the true believers evangalise about it.

    I did see that one of the payment processors had come up with a possible solution for the money thing – they’re looking at being a micro-escrow service that can cater for betting. Still too early to say if it would work for poker though.

  7. Simon Debanks

    I just read that Party poker are removing all multi table tourney rake for a limited time… Might have to dust off my old account

  8. Meteoric

    ah, cool! Not exactly rake free cash games though, but still good to try

  9. Simon Debanks

    Apologies for the endless commenting… Now that I don’t have Rush I’ve obv been shopping around for alternatives. The Stars micro full ring games seem soft but I’m wondering if there’s better games out there that include rake back.

    The Betraiser system looks amazing, I’m pretty shocked that they’ve not got higher traffic. Have you given them a go yet? Rake free plus 7% yearly interest on deposits?! It really does seem too good to be true tbh.

  10. Meteoric

    You and everyone else :-) iPoker seems the best to me at the moment in terms of rb and traffic, although I’ve not deposited anything yet.

    Betraiser would be awesome, but the traffic is non-existent. I’ve had an account for a while but just not played there since there’s never enough going on. The other day I checked in and there was one nl10 table and that was it! Tournies get a bit more traffic, but only just. Real shame…

  11. Meteoric

    wait, 7% interest on deposits? Wow, that’s better than most saving schemes (since our base interest rate is so low). That’s dangerous – I could be sticking all my savings on there and then one night decide to go for a gamble…

  12. Simon Debanks

    haha yeah, dangerous indeed :)
    You’re right it’s a real shame, with decent traffic it would be like printing money. I think I’ll create an account for the tournaments and to keep an eye on the site’s progress.

    Thanks for the info about iPoker, I’ll have a look there next.

  13. yegor

    tl;dr

  14. S1n

    Sup Meteroic, good to your blog still going strong. Shame you’re on such a bad run :-(

    Anyways just thought I’d drop by. hit me up at my usual email if you wanna chat.

    hi yegor! poker still playing you?

Pointless

June 12th, 2011

I’ve good news and bad news. Good news is that I made a real effort to be less of a lagtard and managed to get my W$SD to where LeakBuster thinks it should be!

Bad news is that it cost my the last half of my bankroll and I had to redeposit. What’s even more stupid is that it was still my showdown hands that cost me most of the money!

It seems to me I’m minimising my wins while maximising my losses. Playing the TAG style seems to be exacerbating that too, probably because my non-showdown hands are no longer contributing to my winrate.

Back to LAG? I don’t know, and TBH right now I don’t care. I was having an extremely stable session this morning, and had carved out 2 buy-ins in small-moderate pots, and then got kicked back to square one against a set magnet.

Small wins, big losses – I’m pretty sure this is the key though, I need to flip this around somehow. 7k hands on Carbon now at -18bb/100. Still within the realms of variance though I suppose.

Update:

It was raining today, so played quite a lot of poker. It was frustrating, very swingy stuff, but after a while it seemed to look like it was forming a general upwards line. Roughly it was climbing at 10bb/100, so that’s good.

However it didn’t end well;

Villain on that last hand is a 27/12 who frequently shoves the river, although I’m not sure whether it’s a bluff or not – by the frequency alone I’m assuming it can’t be fat value very often. Somehow he’s built up this massive 500bb stack, and I wasn’t far behind with 300bb (at least 100bb of that was his). I was wondering if we’d end up in a pot where he did his shove the river trick and not realise the consequences of being so deep;

$0.02/$0.04 No Limit Holdem
Merge
5 Players 

Stacks:
UTG ($9.78)
CO ($3.98)
Meteoric (BTN) ($11.49)
SB ($3.91)
BB ($21.58)

Pre-Flop: ($0.06, 5 players) Meteoric is BTN 8diamonds poker card 8clubs poker card
1 fold, CO raises to $0.14, Meteoric raises to $0.48, 1 fold, BB calls $0.44, CO folds

Flop: 4hearts poker card Qspades poker card 6diamonds poker card ($1.12, 2 players)
BB checks, Meteoric bets $0.84, BB calls $0.84

Turn: 3hearts poker card ($2.80, 2 players)
BB checks, Meteoric checks

River: 8hearts poker card ($2.80, 2 players)
BB checks, Meteoric bets $2.10, BB raises to $6, Meteoric goes all-in $8.07, BB calls $4.17

Final Pot: $23.14
BB shows
Jhearts poker card Qhearts poker card
Meteoric shows
8diamonds poker card 8clubs poker card

BB wins $21.99 (net +$10.46)

CO lost $0.14
Meteoric lost $9.39

So it was me that got stung. I’m not sure what I expected, AA,KK or AQ maybe (he never 3bets either – ever! Not preflop or postflop – got caught out by a flatted AK a little earlier before noticing that).

Thoughts

June 8th, 2011

Had a bit of rungood tonight, which was helped by it apparently being Spew Tuesday in the States. I’m still not actually playing better, but things just went my way for a change. I’m pretty sure my big leak (which the crappy W$SD is a symptom of) is that I’m overvalueing one pair hands. Especially the high pairs, like AQ with the Q paired, or KT with the T paired. I set out tonight determined to fold them in the face of aggression, but I doubt I did, although the chance didn’t seem to happen very often tonight for some reason.

I also decided that I want to play more hands in position, and not just against the blinds. If someone has opened before me, my strategy for a long time now has been either 3bet big hands, call pocket pairs, or fold. I guess this is fine (or normal even), but surely it means that when I open, the chances are I’ll be OOP unless it folds to the blinds? Sure my late position ranges are wider than my early position ranges, but while that means I do play more hands IP, they’re weaker hands too.

So I thought what kind of hands can I play if someone has opened before me (other than the PP’s and big Ax’s). I guess it has to be a less dominated range than the opener. So I figured if I call with the range of the position earlier than the opener, then I should be IP with a stronger range? Probably not the most intellectual of strategies, I suppose I should really be considering hand strengths in a different light, ie suited connectors and ranges that don’t overlap theirs (that has a name I expect – merged, balanced, aga range?).

As it happened the situation almost never came up – not enough seats at 6max really. If on the button and the MP opened I never had a hand in my UTG range, CO opening I didn’t have a hand from my MP range etc. I think it happened three or four times at most. And I think those hands went 50/50 anyway (mostly missing & folding to the cbet, or betting when unraised and getting a fold), so no great insights there anyway. I probably should put more thought into it and consider a better calling range that’s based on something more intelligent really.

On another plus note Carbon have sorted out my bonus code, so now I’ve 3 months to clear the 150% deposit bonus. I reckon that’s plenty of time as long as I move up before the end. We’ll see.

Comment as a Post

June 4th, 2011

ok, so a minimal sample on Carbon so far;

but infuriatingly it’s already showing my terrible non-showdown +ve, showdown -ve trend. Terrible because overall it never shows a profit – I’ve seen very few people with this kind of graph, and even less who are profitable (Giev Money being one of the few).

Taking my hands from the last 20k or so, my non-showdown is winning at 10bb/100, which is quite a rate considering that’s virtually most people’s overall winning rate (at nanostakes), yet that is blown totally out of the water with showdown losing at -530bb/100 (wtf!).

I’m not sure which way I’m getting this wrong – am I calling down light, or am I being too strong on my value hands (turning what should be +ve showdown hands into smaller but +ve nonshowdown hands)?

Looking at my Carbon hands, the bulk of mistakes seems to be hands that end up all-in (both pre and postflop). In particular I’m being very light with short stacks, and looking back at it this is adding up to a lot of moronicness.

Nevertheless, the frustration is really about the lack of ability to change – I’m constantly pushing myself to be nittier and nittier, yet the carbon graph is a scaled down version of the 20k graph. Nothing is changing. I’m chipping away at something that is fundamentally flawed, and I’ve yet to see what it is…

Re Phil Ivey, yeah I saw that -was chatting with Yegor as the story was emerging. Initially it looked pretty good that he was speaking up, but then after Full Tilt’s response came out, and we had a closer look at the filed whatsitsname (case?), it was clear that Ivey’s out for himself and this is massively bad for the US players. He may have ruined any short-term chance of them getting their money back, and possibly even long term if FT can’t recover. One part of FT’s response was interesting – they say he owes them a large sum of money. Not many people seemed to have picked up on this, and I’m wondering what ‘large’ means to them, not to mention why he would owe them…

1 comment
  1. Simon Debanks

    wow, awesome comment – post, thanks!
    I find your graphs fascinating because I feel that my downward sloping red line is a real handicap sometimes. If you could just bring your showdown line nearer to break even… I saw a graph from Cole South’s database once and the characteristics were similar but the red line made him more $ than he lost at showdown – which was definitely negative if I recall.
    Well, hope you start to run better :)

I’m a Losing Player

May 29th, 2011

I’m going to have to redeposit again. This is so frustrating, although financially not a big deal – over my lifetime of online poker I’m now into the red and have lost about $130. That’s not a lot for 5 years of ‘entertainment’ – I’ve spent far more on shorter lasting and more trivial pasttimes. But it’s frustrating that my bankroll isn’t self-sustaining, even with proper bankroll management.

This year’s Rush 5nl looks like;

Somehow my losses are exactly equal to the rake I’ve paid. So it really has been 50/50 all the way, with Full Tilt being the only winner thanks to Rake.

Which brings me to my other frustration – Leak Buster has my leaks as pretty much just W$SD (won $ at showdown) being too low. Every other stat is smack on target, even WTSD% (percentage went to showdown). Basically I’m showing down the same amount of hands as a winning player, except my hands are losing more than theirs.

So Leak Buster’s final analysis – I need to run better? Who knows…

Anyway, with the redeposit I’m going to switch games (again). I’m going to drop Rush and go back to regular table games, with the aim to work on my player reading skills. So basically trying to understand player types and how to exploit them, which isn’t really possible on nl5 Rush (too many players, not enough time to build proper stats on them, with position on you constantly changing). It’ll have that double edged benefit of reduced volume though (slower to throw money away, but less visibility of progress through variance).

I’m going to try and deposit on Carbon (Merge network), but they’re having issues with so many players moving to their site and attempts so far have failed. So back to Full Tilt possibly if it fails again.

2 comments
  1. Simon Debanks

    Hey, do u mind me asking how many hands that is? I can’t make it out from the pic on my handheld. It sounds to me like u are just suffering from run bad over your sample, I’m running horribly myself but I have a few big leaks too. I hope it comes around for you.

    Did you hear Phil Ivey took legal action against Full Tilt?!
    Simon.

  2. Meteoric

    that’s 25k hands – runbad is still a possibility I suppose. It feels that I’m edging closer and closer to decent play, but results keep disagreeing with me :-)

    I’ve managed almost 3k hands on Carbon so far (obv a lot slower without Rush and only 3 tabling – that’s the limit for me before opponents become a blur), and I’m down 4 buy-ins. Worse is the garph is my typical redline up, showdown down – um hold on I’ll turn this reply into a post :-) can add pics then…

No Boomswitch yet

May 21st, 2011

If I’m not posting much it’s because poker sucks

Divergence

May 16th, 2011

Standard…

1 comment
  1. simon debanks

    Ouch. That graph looks painfully familiar! :(
    Bring on the BOOM switch!


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